Tech Made Fun | Tech Podcast By SK NEXUS
Pakistan’s numero uno podcast for your upkeep on tech. Tune in every ‘whenever I want to upload’ to catch up to the latest content on ever evolving tech.
Hosted by Saqib Tahir: https://bio.saqibtahir.com/
Site link: https://sknexus.com/tmf
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Tech Made Fun | Tech Podcast By SK NEXUS
TMF 020 - PCs Getting Arm'ed Up - Why You Should Care
Apple's M1 has been the single biggest success in recent computing history. And now Windows wants a piece of that. In today's episode we go over why you should care about the forthcoming x86 to ARM transition....if it succeeds.
Hosted by Saqib Tahir
Support the show: https://support.sknexus.com/
Read full show notes here: https://sknexus.com/ep20/
Read companion article here: https://sknexus.com/arm-vs-x86-for-dummies/
Further learning and references
ARM vs x86: What's the difference?
Arm vs x86: Instruction sets, architecture, and all key differences explained
ARM vs. x86: Differences & similarities of both architectures
What is an ARM processor?
WHY X86 NEEDS TO DIE
Why x86 Doesn’t Need to Die
An AnandTech Interview with Jim Keller: 'The Laziest Person at Tesla'
Nvidia and AMD plan to launch Arm PC chips as soon as 2025, Reuters reports
As always -
Thank you for listening, please send any questions or feedback to podcast@sknexus.com
See you next time.
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Keep the show running: https://buymeacoffee.com/sknexuspk
Welcome to another episode of Tech Made Fun, where we keep the definition of fun very loose. So in today's episode, I want to cover something that happens once in a decade and it doesn't happen often. And I think it's important to talk about it because it will shape up in the next 5-6 years. And which is Windows finally deciding to shift to ARM for their processors. Now, before we get into it, I want to say that there will be a lot of technical concepts in this episode. I will try to make it as easy as possible, try to make it as byte sized as possible. but there will be an attached much more detailed article if you want to learn more about everything we talk about. Okay. That being said, let's get into it. So basically, what was happening for the last 10-15 years is that your personal computing devices like desktops and laptops, which are also called PC, which are running like Mac or Windows. Okay. You use it for your university, for your office, and so on and so forth. And then you have your smartphone, which is in your pocket. So when the smartphone was launched, its power needs, its battery needs, performance needs, or its size was small, right? So according to its unique requirements, the chips used in desktops and laptops at that time, the x86 chips, those weren't really good for the smartphone. So innovation was required and you know, smartphones started using common architecture in their smartphones. Now, as you know, phones weren't that good for the last 5-6 years, they weren't that powerful, battery life had a lot of issues, so on and so forth. popular smartphone. It is clear that your year over year performance upgrade has come to the point that there is no need to buy a new phone every year. Right? And the chips on some of the phones, especially the flagship phones, they're so strong right now, that they can actually run a lot of common use cases or layman use cases at a very good performance. So, thinking about this, what did Apple do four years ago? Roughly, they announced their Apple M1 chipset. Right. It was the first ever Apple's own chipset, which they were saying that we will give it to our laptop. And I think the first device that was released was the M1 MacBook Air with it. And the first M1 MacBook Air that came, it was actually just an iPhone chip, which they rebranded and restructured and put it in the computer. And they believed in it so much that in the next two years, all our computers will go to ARM. And it worked because as I said, for the average consumer and even like with time, the prosumer people who had more requirements, for them, Apple computers have successfully transitioned over to ARM and everything just works. Right? Now in the Windows world, Microsoft saw all this. and I'm not sure who was first, who was later, I'm not reading his argument but they did also something similar which they did with a Surface Pro X device in 2019 with the common chipset but they miserably failed and no one bought those devices, they were not popular, no one even bothered and it was clear that Windows on ARM won't be a reality for a very long time. I'm talking about 2019, roughly 5 years ago. Meanwhile, on Apple land, ARM became a huge success. As I said, all the current Mac desktops and laptops are powered by ARM processors and their M lineup, I think the fourth generation of M4 has arrived. So they have made like year over year improvements and significant jumps over the Intel processors they used to use before, right? I even remember when we did a podcast, we recorded an episode about 2-3 years ago, I said that M1 MacBook Air is hands down the best laptop right now in its class for its price. And the reason is the 3Ps. Okay, so I defined 3Ps in that episode, if you want to go back and listen to it. Basically, the MacBook Air is the perfect combination of the 3Ps of a laptop, which is power, performance and packaging. It means that First of all, the RAM of the MacBook was like 20 hours of battery life. No one has ever seen that amount of battery life in a laptop before that. And it wasn't like 20 hours on paper, like 20 hours in actual use. And I've used that laptop a lot ever since. And you can use it for 10-15 hours comfortably. The fun thing is that if your light is loaded, like you use it for 1-2 hours a day, then you can use that laptop without charging for a whole week. So that power advantage over the Windows competitor at that price point was just like unmatched, which brings us to the second point, which was performance. Now when we talk about performance, Apple does this and I will do this too. We talk about performance per watt. This means that performance per watt being consumed, right? Obviously, if you go to Windows laptop or Windows desktop, you can find better performance, but at the cost of more power. Okay, you have a gaming laptop with RTX 2090, 100 and Intel 20th Gen, that will also have 500W power. That's the thing. Again, I'm exaggerating a little, just to make a point. But the thing is, on Apple, when you talk about performance per watt, that P was covered with the first MacBook Air. In its class, at its price point, there was no other laptop which was offering the same performance per watt. And the third and the last thing was packaging. What is packaging? Slim and light laptop, right? MacBook Air is very common around people who move a lot, they are on the go, they work in the office, so on and so forth, right? So at the weight it was, it had really good packaging and all the premium built aluminum body, big trackpad, so on and so forth. So that is what the MacBook Air was perfect combination of power, performance and packaging. Which is the three things lacking in Windows when they released Surface Pro X. Their detachable keyboard which didn't work for half the time, its performance was nearly as good and its battery life was not good either because Windows wasn't optimized. And the funny thing is that the first laptop Apple launched, M1 Air, they didn't even bother creating like a new body or something. They just took the old Intel MacBook Air, they just put M1's antennas inside it and sold it. But M1 was so good. And literally if you go and watch reviews of M1 launch, everyone liked it so much that people bought it with their eyes closed. They didn't care how it looks. They bought, I think at this point, 4 or 5 years old body, just because it had M1 installed in it. And it was like so much better than the Intel processor that was installed before. So this is a bit of history like ARM vs X86. And the reason I wanted to give that is that you have an idea that the jump from Intel to ARM on Apple's side was very big and very impressive. And from that day till now, from 2019 till 2024, Windows has been trying to replicate their success, but they're constantly failing. Right? And if you want to look into it further, it's easy to explain why. Look, here's a lesson in Apple's biggest advantage. And if you're someone into tech or who's trying to learn about tech, it's very important to understand this because this learning you can apply to all other things in your life when it comes to tech, right? So the biggest advantage of Apple is that it's a completely vertically integrated company. Vertical integration is the best, which I will tell you about in the second episode. Apple makes their own chipsets, makes their own hardware, makes their own software. they control everything end to end. That's why they have an opportunity that they can interconnect everything better, integrate, optimize everything. So their finished product is usually, not always, usually, it is more stable, it is more well connected and if you have multiple products, like let's say your iPhone and MacBook Air, they work together very good also. Right? Secondly, this is behind the success of Apple. Look, Apple makes very few SKUs, SKUs or SKUs, means every year there are 3-4 iPhones, 5-6 laptops or desktops, those are variations, like the actual body is 2-3 only, right? That makes it so that all their products are very high quantity, right? Because they have very few models and then when they go to the factory and ask them to make this M1 chip or M2 chip, it is very easy to backorder. and do like a massive order. Like we have been selling iPhone for 10 crore since last 15 years. We need 10 crore chips. So factories or fabs, which we talked about in the fab episode, they are more likely to partner with Apple at a high priority and a good deal. So if Apple comes and says that I am transitioning this new ARM processor in the next two years, I have six computers, I want to take it out of six Intel and take it to ARM. So TSMC, their fab, they will be onboard because they know that it is Apple, it will sell. It's a good rate and everything becomes a good partnership. And then ever since Steve Jobs passed away, Tim Cook took over. It's been clear that Apple is still the boss of the supply chain. It's simple. When the coronavirus came, everyone's stock was out for 2-3 years, things were not getting sold, it was over, it was over. Apple's things are still selling. They have figured out some black magic that their stock reaches everywhere. iPhone is released, after 3 days, it's on every store, which is the Apple official store, obviously. I am not saying Pakistan, but you don't understand. how good Apple is with keeping up stock throughout the world. Their supply chain management, no one can match it. And the last reason why Apple has a huge advantage over other companies is their dev ecosystem. Now don't get me wrong, Apple is treating devs very badly these days. And there are a lot of news and lawsuits going on and all the issues are going on. But even though then Apple still has the largest control over their devs. So when Apple says that we are going to go on the arm next year, convert all your applications so that they can go on the arm, devs are more likely to listen because Apple devices are used by millions and millions of people and they would want that they are compatible with their apps, right? So that closeness that the dev ecosystem has created There are different things that are being fought these days, but still an ecosystem is being created. There is a place where Apple can control and command and communicate with the devs. And by the way, we want to bring this big shift, so please develop for our thing. This is the reason whenever you are watching an iPhone event, so a new app or a new game comes, its demo is released, why does it happen? Because they have been working on it for the last one year, behind the scenes, not publicly. So by the time that device launches, those apps and all that is already ready to go. Because Apple communicates everything with the developers that this thing is coming, so they can do their thing like this. And the very interesting thing with the ARM transition was that as I said earlier, all the computers were X86 of Apple and now they are ARM. X86 ARM at root level is just an instruction set. Or if you want to put it in very simple words, then understand that it is a kind of language that the computer uses to communicate. So, Now, obviously, the developers who have transitioned and made apps compatible for ARM are fine, but there was still a huge chunk, like 80-90% of the cache from ARM, which were still on X86. So what about those applications? So for that, Apple made a very special thing, which was called Rosetta, which was a translation layer. So what did it do? By the way, your app is X86, you don't have to worry, that will also work. You just have to double click, a pop-up will come. which warns you that this is not a native ARM app, just so you know. And then it will do black magic behind the scenes, which you shouldn't know. And the app will run. There will be some performance set and all that cause it is a translation layer. But for you as the normal average consumer, which is using consumer apps, it would work fine. In fact Rosetta was so good that at launch even prosumer apps like Adobe Premiere and these heavy editing tools were also running well. Which was very, very impressive to be honest. So when you listen to all this and you're like, okay, this is Apple's advantage, that is advantage. So then it becomes really clear why Windows has had such a hard time competing on this front, transitioning to ARM. So the first issue I told you, we'll all flip, right? So there is vertical integration on the side of Apple. There is no vertical integration on the side of Windows because it is horizontal integration. You can't have both. You can either vertically integrate or horizontally integrate. What does horizontal integration mean? Look, you buy Windows. No one buys it. They wear a cap and buy it from the net. But... You can install it on any hardware. You can go and install it on your computer, you can install it on your laptop. You don't like one brand, you can go and buy another brand. You can install it on that. So Windows kind of works like the way Android doesn't work on our phones. That the brand and its flavor change is Android. So yeah, because Windows is so horizontally integrated, that is actually the number one challenge they have. Because if you want to take Windows to ARM, they have to write new Windows, which works on ARM or works better with ARM. And they can't do that because so many models specification or so many brands have their own unique proprietary things. So it's really hard to come up with an update that this is Windows on ARM that will work on every device. It's not possible. It's not that controlled. Where Apple has only 10-15 devices to figure out. Windows has around 1000-2000 devices. So they don't have that vertical integration. That's why they had a really hard time. And then you have to consider the fact also that the Mac side, I don't want to hate on it, but majority use case is your layman use case, right? 80% of the people who use Mac OS are laymen. And by laymen, I don't mean they don't get any work done, but their use case is very lightweight. You have to use web browser, you have to use mail, you have to edit small photos, even video editing. So for them, a light device like MacBook Air is perfectly fine. And if they want something professional, then MacBook Pro is there. But on the Windows side, the line goes even higher, right? First of all, you have gaming which has its own unique requirements, like you need a good GPU, so on and so forth. But even in the prosumer workload, if you go to factories or manufacturing, or those heavy tools that you have, all of those are required to use on your Windows, and a lot of performance is required for that, right? And then like you have things like you have to run simulations in dev environments, or you have to run virtualization, so on and so forth. For those things, the beauty of Windows is that you can easily make your desktop according to your own specifications. And then it will be way more performant you just care about performance, that option has come to you in Windows, right? But this exactly also means that it is very difficult to get ARM on this. But as I said, even more variables. For ARM to be successful, there needs to be control, there needs to be less variables. So that's why it's a big issue for Windows that ARM is on it today. Lastly, the issue of Windows, just to compare and contrast, is the dev ecosystem. As I said, the dev ecosystem of Apple is very controlled, they are confined, they have their own tools, they have their own coding language, so on and so forth. But in Windows, it's like free for all, okay? There are different programs. programming languages, different text stacks, you don't need to put an app in the Windows Store, you can make a direct downloadable virus.rar. Because Windows has that open nature, and by open I don't mean fully open, but compared to Mac or iOS especially, it is very open. That means that when it comes to development, it comes to developers, they are also very open. They have no special connection with their own ecosystem or Microsoft. And they are not developing for Microsoft, right? Usually what happens is that if a person is making an app on Microsoft, they are directly distributing it. When did you download the app from Microsoft store last time? No, you go directly to the website and download it from there. But that is not the case on macOS, where most people download things from macOS app store. And then the same thing came up in the middle, if it's a paid app, Apple has to cut its own, so on so forth. You see where I'm getting with this, that Windows' control on the dev ecosystem is not as strong as Apple's. So when it comes to Windows, that bring the arm. Developers will be like, yes, okay, we'll make it when it comes. Okay, goodbye. So given all these pain points Windows had, for the last 4-5 years, this is what Windows has been saying that it is trying to solve them. Right? So there is a lack of vertical integration. Okay, we will do this, we will focus on very specific devices. Which will be laptops, consumer use, the same MacBook Air strategy. And we will take one or two models of each brand and we will do it only in that. We will not launch everything right now. We will focus on 5-6 models to start with. So they solved the issue of vertical integration like this. There are many different hardware. We're not gonna care about it at all. We're just gonna focus on the average consumer use case. Even if you go to their website, they are broadcasting the average consumer use case, average consumer apps, average consumer usage, all of this. Because they don't want to confuse people that this is a very prosumer thing, or you use this and put your x86-wide computers ahead. No, they're like, these are 5-6 laptops. We are just bringing it here and these are the reasons why. If you are the average person, it doesn't matter if you use an x86 laptop or an ARM, because all the problems are solved for you. And they took a big bet that the average user or the pro user won't care anyways because they have their $6000 desktop PC. Right. And the third thing, because they have a weak control on the dev ecosystem, as I said, so they released their own thing called Prism, which was Apple's Rosetta. But unlike Rosetta, it's not a translation layer. I think it's a simulation layer. There is a difference, but what you need to understand is that the ARM Windows PC, hopefully, all the apps of X86 will run smoothly, with just a little bit of performance hit. So till here, what we discussed is basically that ARM is very good, if done right. Apple did it. had great success with it. Windows tried to do it first, failed, then 5 years passed and now the second attempt of Windows is looking very strong. Right? There are no laptops in the market, 5-6 are out, you can go Google and search for them. And so far, the results are really good. So the general consensus is that the Windows Snapdragon X Elite laptops, this is the name of the chip, they are comparable to Apple's performance, mostly, like 80-90%, which is very good considering that it is the first generation. So obviously, over time, after 1 year, 2 years, 3 years, is going to get better, right? And then you'll have equivalent Windows on ARM devices and then equivalent Mac on ARM devices which are already running. But as a person listening to this, who might be somewhat technical or who is interested in tech, why should you care? Bro, the smartphone was common then, I didn't bother, I don't even know which chip is in my phone. Or, bro, never bothered with my desktop or laptop or all that, right? The thing is why you should care or why anyone should care whenever such a big foundational change comes in the industry is, see, if you are aware about this, if you talk about it, if you spread awareness about it, it brings in acknowledgement and what happens with that acknowledgement? Competition increases. Right? Till now, for the past 15-20 years, who has been the primary contender? Windows or Mac OS? And even from that, Windows has a 90% market share. Mac OS is very small, it only targets the premium segment. Right? But over the last 4-5 years, we have Mac OS, because of this arm transition, they have captured the whole market compared to what they had before. And then on the other hand, Chromebooks has done a good coverage because of the whole coronavirus thing and people wanted a cheap alternative for the computer. So this shift is happening, competition is growing. And now what is happening is that when the arm comes, which is open source architecture, but it is more open than the Intel and AMD options that are available in the market. That means businesses will be more experimental. They'll come up with maybe different types of devices. Not only laptops and test-tops will be available. As you have seen, handles have started coming, streamdeck has been made, Asus ROG has been made. Maybe we finally get a Windows tablet that actually works and is usable and whose battery life is not two hours. And so on and so forth. The reason if you're listening to this, if you're at this point and you're like, okay, why should I care? If you care, spread the message. More people will care. If enough people. people will care. A demand is generated of the variety competition, right? You don't have to be stuck in one ecosystem. There are more options for you because not everyone can go for like a thousand dollar MacBook Air, where they have 200 dollars in their pocket. And then if you have 200 dollars and then there are no good options in the market because all those options have been monopolized or consolidated, right? But you're like, yeah, I don't have 200 dollars in my pocket, I have 50 dollars in my pocket. What about that? So this is also very beneficial because of this transition happening, x86 going to ARM. x86 is not going to go anywhere. In Windows, as I said, the market share is 90% and it won't be 90% overnight. They are doing this very slowly, very gradually. In the beginning, they are only doing this with laptops, that too with consumer-grade laptops. Before we see, let's say, even 50% adoption, it might take 10 years and I'm not even kidding. But in the meantime, what will happen is that all the laptops of X86, which were in perfect working condition because of this hype cycle and because of the benefits of ARM and all that, people have started throwing it. And the thing that is thrown, where does it come from? It comes from Pakistan. lot. As we have covered in the second episode, that makes it a perfect opportunity to see for the next 5-6 years, yes, maybe later, but for the next 5-6 years, my work is running on X86 laptops. So because of this influx of X86 used laptops, if you have$50 or $100, maybe options open for you too. That's why also you should care about this and promote it. Yes, yes, go ahead, give me the old one. And I'll give you a very good example in the car industry. You see, the car industry in Pakistan used to move so slowly. Because what will happen? Honda will take out its car after 10 years, Toyota will take out its car after 15 years, Suzuki will take out its car after 8 years. And by that I mean, what do we do in between? Just change the light, change the bumper, change the car. There was no innovation for the majority of history in Pakistan, right? car industry. So what happens is that I go and buy the current Corolla, the 2024 model and the 2013 model that I have, the shape E140 model, with the Mumble light removed, that Corolla of 2013 and the Corolla of 2024 that is being sold now, there is no difference except for the Mumble light. The interior is exactly the same, the features are exactly the same, the engine is exactly the same. So then what happens? Let's say I have a 2015 Corolla and it has only driven 2000 km. I can still sell it for 50-60 lakhs rupees. Why? Because competition has never been built in the market, variety has never come, so the person who has bought a new thing, the old thing has the same value because it is new and the old thing has not much difference. Now it is changing in the car industry. But the effect of this will be, if you have ever been to a foreign country or if you have seen it, you will get a car for $1,000. Some junkers, like in America, if you have $5,000, you will get a used Civic, used Corolla, in good condition. If you know anyone from Dubai or Saudi Arabia, if you look there, used cars are usually one third of the price of the new car. So if the new car is worth 50 lakhs, the used car is worth 15 lakhs. And in good condition, like the driver's... can be used for 5-6 years more. But for that to happen, there needs to be enough innovation so that people who are capable of buying new things can buy new things and the value of the old things will decrease because new things have come into the market. But if it happens in the market that there are only 1-2 options, then the value of the old things will not decrease if the person buys the new thing, it will not depreciate and the people who can't afford the new things will never get that option. So now I know, this car example is a little out, but the exact same trickle-down effect logic works on our technology too. What is the average price of the laptop of X86 right now? 1,00,00 to 2,00,00. A consumer grade brand new pricing. When you give pricing to Pakistan, you have to say brand new because they bring the use pricing in the middle. Oh, this is a brand new pricing. Brand new X86 consumer laptop is available between 1 to 2,00,00. This is the pricing spectrum right now. Let's say I bought a laptop of 1,50,00. I can easily sell it for 80-90 thousand rupees. Because X86 is still popular and the laptop line is still popular. And because there are not many models in Pakistan, it is easily sold. And I have already done this. And I do the same with my laptop. I bought it, used it for 4 years and then due to dollar inflation and so on and so forth. I easily sell it for 70-60% of the price. But now if the options of mangoes have started coming in Pakistan, it becomes a wide enough adoption thing. It becomes popular enough. The person who is purchasing a new laptop, they don't care how much they sell it for. Because let's say, he is rich. They just want the mango, the mango is looking good, the processor is good, I want its benefits, which I have already told you about, performance, power packaging, so that mango will take it. And then the X86 laptop will usually go for cheaper, because it will sell to a shopkeeper and the shopkeeper will say that there is no value for it, the mango has come, this is an old model. And then what will happen, the market will gradually flood with the X86 laptop. That opens up room for you. The used X86 laptop, the one worth 1.5 lakhs, the one worth 70-80 thousand, you may get it in 50 thousand. right? It goes all in circle. And the funny thing is, most people won't know better, right? But you, you listening to this episode, you know that because I told you and you take my word for it, what it means, that you don't have to worry about the next 4-5 years. Everything will work on X86, everything will run, anyway, all the icons are web apps and it doesn't really matter if it's ARM or X86. Unless you need any ARM specific features, your X86 laptop will run great. In fact, let me tell you one more funny thing. We have to come up with an episode after one or two episodes specifically on this topic. how to buy a used laptop in Pakistan. So if you're listening to this, do tune in for that episode as well. Okay, so there's one reason you should care about this because competition. More competition, better, right? More competing, more better. The second reason I've given is that because of this, if this becomes a thing, both parties benefit. Those who want to afford new things, Arm is an excellent option for them. And those who are in the used market, the current tech for them will be a little more affordable and accessible. But there is a third benefit on this as well, which is a little hypothetical, but I'm gonna tell anyways. that if you often watch tech reviews or follow Apple, then you know that, as I said earlier, their devices work very well together. And the reason why they are able to do that, or one of the reasons is because all of them are running on the same instruction set. Your iPhone has an ARM chip, your laptop has an ARM chip, so on and so forth. And because of that, they cross-communicate very good. So hypothetically speaking, One day, you may have an ARM processor in your Windows, or in your phone. That enables the same type of compatibility between both devices. So that's the step one. Like that's the basic, right? Even now, I think you can connect your Android device to Windows and you can do a lot of things on it. But let's take it a step further. Now imagine a world where you don't have to buy a computer. Because ARM has become so popular and every device uses an ARM chipset. The developers or software makers, they figure out that we are developing a new tech stack. that you just have to make an app once and it works on mobile and desktop too. What happens then is a day might come where you only need one device, like your smartphone, and when you need a computer, you put a monitor, cable, mouse on it by hundreds of ways that are possible and probably more by then. And that's what your computer is made of. Right? Now just think about it, that magical future. Although some devices are attempting it by the way, it's not fully future. Like if you have a Samsung phone, it has a feature called DeX. If you connect your monitor, then it comes with an Android desktop version in which you can use it like a computer. But I'm not talking about like a computer. I'm saying that it becomes exactly like a computer. Right. You only have to worry about one device which you can carry around. So your computer during the day and your smartphone at night. For the average consumer who just wants to browse the web, watch media, see emails, work on their Excel sheet. For that, this is a very interesting detail, to be honest. I personally want to have something like that. And I... three computers and three phones everywhere. But I can go on and on about this, why ARM is good and a net benefit if you transition to it. And as I said, if you want detailed articles or reading, links will be posted. We have also put an article on the website, you can go and read that too. There is one article that I really liked, which is why x86 needs to die. And this is a very technical article, but it's still funny to see that some people really, really hate x86, right? But that being said, I do want to say that It's not all rainbows and roses. There are some negatives also and that's natural, right? Whenever you go through a transition at a fundamental level or foundational level, there are going to be growing pains or transitioning pains and they are there in ARM as well, right? Number one, the biggest pain that I feel as a tech enthusiast, and again, regular people might not care about it, that the biggest benefit of Windows was that you had customization. I need 16 GB RAM, 32 GB RAM, I go buy a RAM stick, I can upgrade it. I need the hardest, I go buy the hardest, upgrade it. desktop, I can change basically everything, motherboard, CPU, GPU, I can install a CD-ROM. That flexibility is a big part of Windows, as I said before, for those who have unique use cases, that flexibility is available. But the nature of ARM is such that the chipsets of ARM are system-on-a-package or something like that. What that means is that on one chip, your RAM, hard disk, your CPU, GPU, everything has to be solved. So you can only have limited flexibility and that too the brand that is selling, it is up to them to give it to you or not. And the second biggest problem is You can't really change it after you've bought something, right? Like if I buy a MacBook M1 Air, 8GB RAM, 256GB hard disk, that's it. I mean, I can't upgrade it, I can't sell it. So as I said, for the average person and with like stuff like cloud computing and all that, this might not be an issue. But for people who use tech a bit more than for the average use case, this is a big issue for them because you have to understand, right now it's Apple, but I'm sure it will be the same on Windows tomorrow. Bro, you have to go from 8GB to 16GB for 200$ extra. like stupid pricing because everything is way more expensive because it's on a package plus profit margin. And like everything has to be controlled. Whereas the current Windows ecosystem is way more accessible in the sense that I can slowly upgrade it, right? I don't have to make all the decisions while purchasing it, I can upgrade it later. So this is, I think, the biggest drawback of transitioning to ARM. And following that, the second biggest issue I think will be, and this might be my ignorance. Yeah, I can't perceive it properly, but I don't think desktops will ever transition to ARM in a big way. In small way, you know, maybe mini PCs can do this. But the use case of desktop and laptop are very different use cases. And I think ARM, as I said before, it's very performant per watt. But if I don't have a watt limitation, the current X86 chips of Intel AMD, they are way more performant in more use cases. Extreme Gal or enthusiast use cases. So what I feel, or what my concern with you is that after 3-4 years, We'll have two windows basically. We'll have windows on arm. And then we'll have Windows on x86. And you can still see some proof of this because Microsoft has launched a new naming scheme for the new laptop that is called Co-Pilot Plus PC. And to be a Co-Pilot Plus PC, you either need to have an ARM chipset, because those features will only work on those. Or if you have an x86 chip, it should have some kind of performance of 40 tops, of NPUs, which is a neural network. So the thing is that Microsoft also knows that we need to rebrand it and differentiate between these two things in an easy to understand, consumer friendly manner. co-pilot plus branding. So as I said, I think in 4-5 years, we will have co-pilot plus PC which will be arm enabled or NPU enabled and on the other side, we will have dumb PCs, I guess. And these dumb PCs are not dumb for a long time because already... after seeing Apple's success with Armchip and the focus on AI. Which we are not covering in this episode, but there is another selling point of Armchip that there are AI features on it, which have been newly announced by Windows. So Intel and AMD, they said, brother, we will put so much performance in our x86 chips that you don't have to use Armchip. Because at the end of the day, if Armchip is successful, Intel and AMD's business is gonna hurt, right? All your Dell laptops, HP laptops, Lenovo laptops, where does the chip come from? Intel or AMD? But if Armchip is successful, extension Snapdragon, which is also being made, then that market share will go to Snapdragon, which is good for competition. But from their perspective, it's bad for business. So they're going to try their best to stay in X86, to fulfill all the needs of AI. So yeah, like the next four or five years, it will be very interesting to see this massive shift in the industry. I'm not gonna say that this is a big deal like the iPhone or the smartphone revolution, but it is very foundational and very impactful because X86 and all these chipsets have been running for the last 20-25 years. It's gonna affect everything you touch in the next 4-5 years, like it or not. But I'm interested to hear what you think about this, if you have gotten to this point. Usually, only 2% people reach this point. What is the biggest issue you think with everything going on with Ambrite? What do you think is the problem with this transition? Or your... What's the concern? You're an x86 fanboy, you're an interlamby fanboy, and you're like, no, hate on us. Or do you like it that this is happening and finally we might get some competition? Because this is gonna force Intel and AMD to step up their game also, right? And this is like a step in a direction away from consolidation. You don't want everything to be owned by just one party. Because as we discussed, two or three episodes ago, when we were talking about SadaBe in Pakistan, that SadaBe was bought by Papadha, right? And the acquisition happened, obviously. Unfortunately, two days ago, the news came that 50 to 60 people had fired SadaBe 18. and you are doing all that job seeking. And this is exactly the thing I was mentioning in that episode also, that whenever there is corporate consolidation, a big company comes and buys a small company. It's never a good site. And this is what happens in Pakistan's startup ecosystem time and time again. Big company comes, small company will buy, then... Okay, let me explain how acquisitions work. Because I talked to an employee of Sadapeh, not gonna name names, but it was kind of surprising that they were hoping for the best when the news of acquisition came. And I was like, my brother, acquisition is happening. start reading your medicine, start reading your Tasbih. Acquisition is never a good deal for existing employees. So maybe he didn't understand this or maybe he was a very positive and hopeful person so he didn't want to think about it. But generally speaking, if a company gets acquired, the number one thing that usually happens immediately or a few months later, is that half the team is fired. And the reason they are fired is that the big companies have an excuse that we already have employees, architecture, infrastructure, we are using yours. So this is all nonsense. Cut off this. This is pure cost. We don't want to deal with it. Now buyers do this work with respect. There are 7-inch packages and all that. And what happens in Pakistan, one email goes and 50 people fire. And apparently this has happened with Sadape as well. Because why wouldn't they, right? Papra is already a billion dollar fintech company. They don't need a Pakistani engineer, they already have a lot of engineers. They just needed a simple brand, their product and their users needed access. That's what they paid for. They don't care about the operations running here. They have their own team, they will integrate. It doesn't matter if it's cultural integration or not, it's a Turkish company. This is a Pakistani company. But just to say, whenever something gets acquired, expect someone is going to get fired, yeah, some cost is going to get cut. And this is exactly why I want to talk about topics like this on this podcast sometimes, because awareness raising is the number one thing, right? We need to raise more awareness in tech in general, and then how that tech affects your life, your career, your business, so on and so forth. As always, thank you for listening. And please send any questions or feedback to podc And in today's after show topic. We're going to talk about a weird ad I saw. Okay, so these days because I resumed this podcast and now I am making two podcasts as dedicated as I can, one is TechMetFund and the Wandering Pro. So to say that for outreach or to reach people, I am being active on social media. I am not good at it. And if you want to learn more about why, the last episode of the Wandering Pro, I covered it in the after show segment that why I struggle with it. But yeah, using social media, the worst thing, and I'm sure a lot of people would agree, is... the ads and especially, normal ads, whatever, but Pakistani ads are not some kind of fake, which makes you angry. So recently I was just scrolling through my Instagram feed, I believe, and now I don't remember the name of the company. or what was the brand and that shows how bad people are at making ads over here. The main thing about ads is that the top of the mind awareness is not fulfilled at all. But if you have made a script or something, then the views have come and the marketing team is clapping. Look, so many views have come in our ad. People have engaged so much. Anyway, I did engage with that ad. I don't remember at all what was the name of the company. And the ad really frustrated me because what was in it? There was a tracker. Okay. And it was a tracker like this tag or... There was another company, I don't remember the name. Basically, you can buy a small thing, keep it in your wallet, keep it in your bag, keep it in your car and then you can track it using your smartphone. Now, the purpose of these devices is usually for lost items. If you put it in your bag, if it's lost, then you can know where your bag is and you can go and recover it right. Or you forgot something else. So, people often take it a little extreme and start using it as a car tracker. Which is not the smartest thing to do in my opinion. But anyway, in the ad, they showed that the guy had put a tracker on his car. And his car was stolen. A thief came, started the car and took it away. Now, like any other reasonable person, what they would do is, we'll go to the police, we'll get the report done, we'll give the location on the tracker and tell them. What is shown in this ad? The guy called from the time he saw the car standing here, he got there. And I don't remember what happened next, but it was something along the lines of, brother, you stole my car, now return it to me, I don't want your location. And the reason I got so frustrated was that I'm pretty sure someone will be dumb enough to try this. And then they must have shot him in the head. Because see, your car has been stolen, some thief has stolen it, and like in Pakistan, it's probably a professional thief. So I would advise against running after the person who just stole your car. And that just frustrates me that they have grown up in ads of products like Sona belt and Hyde Gainer and now they have a digital version of it, which is like totally absurd, outlandish concepts, that you buy our product and this will be possible. The real world doesn't work like this. And if you're listening to this and you're like, hey, my car is a tracker, my car is stolen, what should I do? Like I said, go to the police. Yes, I know it's not helpful, but you don't have any other option. But let's just say you have to become a hero. Then they at least have the common sense that Look, wait for 2-3 hours, the car is parked at a public place. Go and see from a distance where the person is standing. What is happening with him. And then if there is no one around, the coast is clear. Okay, go inside with your emergency key and don't go outside. But again, big disclaimer, I'm not saying you do this, but it's a way better alternative to what is shown in the ad. Consider this tech to totk as public service announcement that by then Please, if you see ads on social media, don't even think for a second that the experience of owning a product will be like that ad. I can tell you, I can guarantee you. Then you will look at that ad and buy something and later you will say, okay, this is not right. And then you will be frustrated and then you will tag the company and say, your product is so bleak. Doesn't help anyone.
